Is there any way to increase my ankle crank?

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 21 Oct 2007 16:28

me and ben have way more experience in this so why fight it? i think you kind of are being an ass imo.

and as long as your not drilling it with an ankle wieght i dont think it would be too big of a problem.

the thing is. to do a clipper, you dont need to have crank, crank comes with time, what you need i cushion... thats first...

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 16:30

professor wrote: No, it's not. Look at all the people who aren't good that have great crank.

I never see them

professor wrote:Your classifications are totally subjective to the way you think.

probably

professor wrote:I'd say David, Lon, and Jorden have average crank not "pretty good".

your right, actually i think lons is better, but since i have so little footage of him...

professor wrote:"Landes has great crank.

You really think so? its worse than davids.

professor wrote:I don't understand why you brought up style as it has little to do with crank and is also totally subjective.

Why did i bring up style? to show that crank has everything to do with style. I tried to think of every stylie person i could with bad crank, and my list came to one. I should have included people with average crank in the style list, but i was getting lazy. Even if i did, i still think the most players with the best style have really good crank.

I also dont think that style is totally subjective. Opinions vary slightly from person to person, but i am absolutly certain that almost every player holds very similar opinions on style. Why else would certain players recieve three pages of props about thier style when they post a video, and most other players recieve a maximum of 2 or 3?

HG · Post by HG » 21 Oct 2007 16:32

so if i practice clipper with a chair cushion, will my crank be better?

i have tried clippers with ice packs, hot packs, small rodents (to increase the roll factor to improve my form).

the best way, i have found, to increase crank is to sit down with your ankles in maximum crank, place 20+ lb weights on each cranked foot, and do 20 reps each foot up and down. This strengthens your ligaments and increases flexibility.

Another way is to do a brocka mod on your ankles. if you chop a small bit of the tendons in your ankle, it lets your foot swing more freely, giving your more crank. I believe this is what matt cross did.

gMoney · Post by **gMoney** » 21 Oct 2007 16:34

and as long as your not drilling it with an ankle wieght i dont think it would be too big of a problem.

Ha, I didn't mean drilling with weights

I mean taking like a large book or small weight disk and standing in clipper position for like 10 seconds. Using ankle weights would definately kiiillllll your legs.

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 21 Oct 2007 16:37

i personally think that jordens ankle crank isnt that great, and the reason that the "best" have ankle crank is because either a) they natuarally had good ankle crank or b) they've developed it OVER TIME like ive been saying, i for one know that jim hasnt always had awesome ankle crank, as i kick with him prety much everyday.

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 16:47

Zeb Jackson wrote:me and ben have way more experience in this so why fight it? i think you kind of are being an ass imo.

and as long as your not drilling it with an ankle wieght i dont think it would be too big of a problem.

the thing is. to do a clipper, you dont need to have crank, crank comes with time, what you need i cushion... thats first...

\

yah im being kind of an ass, sorry, but im kinda pissed with life right now.

your right, you dont need crank, like i said, i picked up clipper like it was nothing, and my crank sucks. if crank comes with time, how come some players who have been playing forever have bad crank? I have something to tell you, something like crank, if it was just going to come, would have come after seven months of play, its not just gonna come.

this hole last statement pisses me of. As far as cushion goes, have you ever even watched vasek play? He hardly cushions the bag at all, he sticks his perfectly level foot out, near the ground, and the bag sticks because it has nowhere else to go.

Proper clipper form means your delaying foot is all the way behind the foot. from this position, for a move like paradox whirl, the bag is set from far back on one side of your body to far back on the other. To do this without compromising something, you need flat ankles. Otherwise you will put spin on the bag, catch it too far forwards, waste energy pulling your setting foot back as you set, or spin to get into the correct position. All of these are detrimental to someones game

gMoney · Post by **gMoney** » 21 Oct 2007 17:04

As far as cushion goes, have you ever even watched vasek play? He hardly cushions the bag at all, he sticks his perfectly level foot out, near the ground, and the bag sticks because it has nowhere else to go.

Vasek can do that. He's got his own way to do clippers now, after playing for a long ass time. When people say "cushion your clippers" they're usually taking to beginners, or people that seem to have bad form. I don't usually cushion mine, but when I was a beginner, it was the easiest way to understand and land them. And since it was a beginner who started this thread, Zeb was conditionally right. Plus he added this nice little hint to go along with it:

what you need is cushion... thats first...

something like crank, if it was just going to come, would have come after seven months of play, its not just gonna come.

Of course it's not just going to come like magic, but the more you do clippers, and the more you stretch and strengthen the muscle, the better your crank will be.

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 17:05

HG wrote: Another way is to do a brocka mod on your ankles. if you chop a small bit of the tendons in your ankle, it lets your foot swing more freely, giving your more crank. I believe this is what matt cross did.

brilliant! I've always wondered what i was going to do with that license to perform surgery.

In all seriosness, thanks for the reply, and i will keep in mind your opinion that i can do nothing.

Zeb Jackson wrote: they've developed it OVER TIME like ive been saying, i for one know that jim hasnt always had awesome ankle crank, as i kick with him prety much everyday.

I totally noticed a recent crank increase! I just assumed it was because he was playing with quantums. I guess you would know, though, since you play with him. It seems like there was a leap between quantumless play and quantumed play. But as far as earlier penske goes, i see no diference between 2004 footage and late 2006 (where he has really good crank, but its not supercrank like with quantums). Once again though, you would know better
I hope your right, because no matter how little it may help, i would like to one day have better crank

Sorry for being an ass, its just my life and my legs are fucked, so i dont come off to nice. Thanks for the replies everyone.

Having good style may depend more on things i really cannot change. Im bowlegged, duck footed, flat footed, have a leg length descrepency, and I overpronate severly. I really should save that info for my eventual footblog, but oh well.

Dat · Post by **Dat** » 21 Oct 2007 17:08

Work on your body setup and positioning instead of your crank. Crank is the end result of, ie dependent on, body setup/positioning; you don't start with crank and try to force your posture to compensate. Horse before cart sort of situation. You don't really need that much crank anyway.

Pay attention to where you aim the bag in relation to your body, your footwork leading into clipper, and which way your head, torso, legs, and arms are rotating/moving during the entire execution of clipper. These should ALL be reversed on your flipside. Do some cross training for your core/torso if your balance feels off.

janis · Post by **janis** » 21 Oct 2007 17:31

Having been through the whole crank issue, I don't think crank is as important as many people think. Sure for some moves like frigid osis, crank makes life a lot easier, but ultimately good form is what really makes the difference for all the standard tricks. I think getting the right body positioning makes a huge difference, much more than crank. Keep in mind players like Lynton were great without needing heaps of ankle crank.

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 17:33

Dat wrote: Pay attention to where you aim the bag in relation to your body, your footwork leading into clipper, and which way your head, torso, legs, and arms are rotating/moving during the entire execution of clipper. These should ALL be reversed on your flipside. Do some cross training for your core/torso if your balance feels off.

I know this already, i actually read related topics, and practice my form.

Dat wrote: you don't start with crank and try to force your posture to compensate. Horse before cart sort of situation

I KNOW

Dat wrote: Work on your body setup and positioning instead of your crank. Crank is the end result of, ie dependent on, body setup/positioning

Crank is the ability to flex your ankle. This, along with body position, helps to bring your foot to a parallel position while you clipper. It is not the result of body position. Matt cross would have supercrank no matter how he held his body.

Dat wrote:You don't really need that much crank anyway.

lots of crank makes every clipper trick i can think of easier

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 21 Oct 2007 17:35

im not going to argue but i will describe to you vaseks ankle crank...

ok when you first started learning legover (for instance) you set the bag, dex the bag, and catch the bag, in a very exagerated motion (compared to doing them really good) and gradually over time you refine them, to where they look simplistic and easy, now...back to vasek, its the same concept, vaseks done so many clippers that hisi body naturally uses the least amount of energy possible to throw that seemless 2 add that we all know and love...

hes cushioning,its just not as exagerated as someone whos been playing for a small amount of time...catch my drift?

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 17:39

hmm, anyone know where i could find footage of this linton fellow? Im afraid he must have been a little before my time or something.

oh, and for the last time, i already know how to clipper ! jesus.

If you feel like critiqing my game/clipper position, wait until im back to health and can put out some footage. Thats not to say I wont have bad form, just wait until you know i have bad form.

Edit: I posted this before i saw your reply, dont worry im calm. And dats the one telling me I have bad form

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 21 Oct 2007 17:42

i was quoting someone who said vasek didnt cushion... not that you have bad form....

calm down

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 17:42

Zeb Jackson wrote:im not going to argue but i will describe to you vaseks ankle crank...

ok when you first started learning legover (for instance) you set the bag, dex the bag, and catch the bag, in a very exagerated motion (compared to doing them really good) and gradually over time you refine them, to where they look simplistic and easy, now...back to vasek, its the same concept, vaseks done so many clippers that hisi body naturally uses the least amount of energy possible to throw that seemless 2 add that we all know and love...

hes cushioning,its just not as exagerated as someone whos been playing for a small amount of time...catch my drift?

Im not arguing either, really. I agree, he does cushon, but i still think that his least amount of energy is less than mr.crappycrank's least amount of energy...catch my drift?

Edit, I posted that before i saw your reply, dont wory, im calm

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 21 Oct 2007 17:44

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FMeQ-6pQG0

in this video jorden doesnt have great crank, its the way hes postioning his body that give him the flatness in the ankle, not how much he can stretch his ankle...just an example

Stoneman · Post by **Stoneman** » 21 Oct 2007 17:55

I love that video. Especialy the first thirty seconds.

that looks like pretty standard crank for Jorden. Average clipper flatness.

this topic is about flexability in the ankle, not body positioning. If crank means something else to y'all, forget me saying crank, and replace that word with ankle flexability

gMoney · Post by **gMoney** » 21 Oct 2007 18:19

ok when you first started learning legover (for instance) you set the bag, dex the bag, and catch the bag, in a very exagerated motion (compared to doing them really good) and gradually over time you refine them, to where they look simplistic and easy, now...back to vasek, its the same concept, vaseks done so many clippers that hisi body naturally uses the least amount of energy possible to throw that seemless 2 add that we all know and love...

that's what I meant, but it's not what I said

Sorry if I caused any confusion by saying Vasek doesn't cushion, I meant what you said, it just didn't come out right

Post by **Zac Miley** » 21 Oct 2007 20:26

Look at Stephen Barnes.

I just noticed today that his clippers aren't flat at all, but his style doesn't feel overexerted (in fact, it's probably the opposite).

David Clavens. Jorden (already said).

Dude, come on. It seems like you're making excuses (even though you apparently have good clipper form?). Who cares about crank. If you have it, you're lucky. If you don't, have good form.

Why is this even a debate? Who gives a shit?

Video of Stephen (and others, he's the one in the white shirt at the beginning): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgE3zndq6GA

Dat · Post by **Dat** » 21 Oct 2007 21:04

My post wasn't directed at you personally stoneman, it was to add to the
whole thread.

Stoneman wrote:Crank is the ability to flex your ankle. This, along with body position, helps to bring your foot to a parallel position while you clipper. It is not the result of body position. Matt cross would have supercrank no matter how he held his body.

lots of crank makes every clipper trick i can think of easier

Your ankle can bend inward for clipper in more ways than one. It can bend more towards your heel side or your big toe side. This is controlled by which muscles you're using in your lower leg, which are influenced by the tension from your muscles/tendons/ligaments up around your knee, then hips, and the rest of your posture. That's why body position requires attention regarding ankle crank.

For example on my right foot clipper, if raise my right hip then my ankle bends up more towards the heel side naturally. If I let my right hip drop my ankle bends up more towards my big toe, and it is less comfortable and less flat than the previous way. The second way is how I did my flip clipper for years and I thought my ankle was just less flexible. Now I can my control my flip clipper the first way and it feels just as good, without rigorous stretching.

Crank is only one element in executing clipper. There are so many other, more productive aspects to work on to improve your clipper, like core control, bag placement, timing, planting, bag line of sight, etc. Ask Matt Cross how hard he worked and still works even though he has that ankle crank.