Oh such bad words. Censorship?

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 07 Feb 2004 15:12

I think it's very hard for people who have not grown up as an ethnical minority to understand why and how racism was so offensive.

One of my strongest memories was on my first day of school at a new school when I was in grade 3 (about 10 years old) when this guy I didn't know came up to me and said. "My grandad used to kill people like you. If he saw you then he'd take out his gun and blow your head off" He was of course talking about my asian heratige and the fact that his grandad killed asians in world war two. At that stage, I had no idea how to deal with that kind of a comment, and so now I guess I have like a complex or something - and racists comments effect me a lot more, then say - someone telling me I smell. I had white friends later on, that used to jokingly call me racist names. And even though I knew they were joking, it still made me feel bad, because it reminded me of past experiences and it made me feel like I was different to them.

HighDemonslayer · Post by **HighDemonslayer** » 08 Feb 2004 19:12

That sounds pretty powerful. I don't think you have a complex. My gramps fought in WWII, in Europe. But I didn't have hatred for those "Krauts" (it even took me a few minutes to remember that "slur").

I forgot what my other point was, now I'm thinking about bratwurst.

-n

pill · Post by **pill** » 08 Feb 2004 21:20

qphox wrote:That's where the word "faggot" came from, guy. Sure, it's defined as a bundle of sticks; kindling. But here's the thing: Back when homosexuality was basically punishable by death, the manner in which they were executed was often by burning.

Thus the homosexuals being burnt were considered kindling themselves.

this is correct but a little off from the way i understand it. it's not that they were just burned to death it's that they werent good enough to be burned with the other other people, they were considered worse than rapists and murderers, so they were burned before them to "kindle" the fire

p.s.

all you straits

the popular slang around these parts seems to be breeders instead of straits =P just a little pop culture lesson

King Monkey · Post by **King Monkey** » 09 Feb 2004 04:56

i dont think its a great idea to say the N-word to any coloured person, even if they are using offensive stuff back at u like 'whitey' or 'limey' or whatever. but thats prob just a personal thing cos i would be killed for saying it (being small and skinny and white and an obvious beat-up target

)
for me there would just be the intimidation factor, i think that may be why some ppl get away with racial slurs against others, while other ppl dont, in some cases

rodimius · Post by **rodimius** » 09 Feb 2004 15:27

Just to slightly derail the topic here, I remember about 15 or so years ago it was really common here in England to be called a "Jew", or "Jewbag" if you were being selfish, keeping things to yourself. At the time I would have been about five or six, and I actually remember using this. I was thinking back, and as soon as I realised or was taught what it actually meant I stopped using it, I guess around seven or eight.

I was thinking that it takes a particularly juvenile, or perhaps cruel, mind to carry on using a word or phrase that you know will be hurtful to others like this.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 09 Feb 2004 15:41

I have hundreds of events that happened in my life like that one, so maybe for someone who doesn't experience any racism (apart from once being called a whitey by a coloured man) it would be a powerful experience, but for ethnic minorities, those kind of things are a common occurance. Often racsists are also very ignorant. I've been called black and other words associated with that. I was also spat on and called a terrorist after september 11.

My point is that ethnic majorities (usually white people) really have no idea why racism is so offensive and why the minorities have so much ill feeling towards them. It is clearly rasicst to think that all white people are racist, but every single person I have met who has made racist comments to me, has been white. Less tolerant and understanding people than myself would make judgements about that.

The worst racism I find, is the disguised racism. Australia's Prime Minister is excellent at that. At the train station last night, there was a woman (probably homeless) asking people for cigarettes. I was feeling sorry for her, up to the moment when some Indians ignored her and she made some comment about their race. It made me realise that she was the kind of person that would vote for Howard - even though Howard has made life much harder for poor people. He makes a strong comment like "We will decide the people that enter the country and the manner in which they do so" and all the racists say - that's exactly right, lets stop those towel head terrorists from coming into the country. They then vote on an issue that only really effects about 4,000 asylum seekers every year (and not really anybody else - because 4000 people doesn't really effect the economy of a country with over 20,000,000 people) rather than voting on the issues that will make things better for themselves.

Howard's statement is not racist by itself, it's only when you know what he is referring to, that you can see the rasism of the statement - so when educated people say - hey, that's a bit racists isn't - hasn't Australia moved on from that - uneducated people (or greedy, nasty people) respond with comments like "he's not referring to race - just all illegal immigrants"

But when you look at the policy of the Australian Government. Howard's government spends billions of dollars every year to keep out 4,000 aslyum seekers (approx 4 billion a year in total costs - thats $1 million per person) even though 80% of those 4,000 will be allowed into the country eventually anyway and in the history of Australia an approved asylum seeker has never been charged with a crime (and the only crimes the non approved have been charged with have been related to them wishing to stay in the country and have harmed nobody except sometimes themselves). The majority of these Asylum seekers come from Iraq, Afghanistan and Iran (three countries that the Australian government also recommends you do not travel to these countries under any circumstances - even wth an armed guard).

Meanwhile in Australia we have over 60,000 illegal imigrants - 95% of which are white every year. The government spends less than $4 million trying to catch these illegals...

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 09 Feb 2004 16:24

I think over time, say 100 years or so, the races will be mixed a lot more than they are now. Making racists terms obsolete.

Jeremy has nailed it on the head that it is the ignorant who are most racist. It is a fear of the unknown that makes people stick to their beliefs. Especially if those beliefs were pasted down from generation to generation.

I am orignally from the Southern United States. North Carolina to be exact. We have the Klan, we have the black panthers, we have the CIA, and we have terrorists. My grandmother fears black people. She will tell you to your face that she doesn't, and behind your back she'll spit some of the nastiest racial slurs you can think of. Many terms are very offensive and would get you killed in LA.

My sister has 2 milano (EDIT: Mullato, I was thinking it was spelled like the cookie, no offense to any crackers

) children. This sent my grandmother into overload and she disowned my sister. WTF is that all about?

Needless to say I moved as far away as my education could take me. Now I live in CA.

I think that some of the oldest generation is still harboring ill feelings towards opposing races and sees them somehow as a threat to their well being (which is crap).

Senor Grommet · Post by **Senor Grommet** » 09 Feb 2004 18:02

its not "milano," the term is "mullato-" half african american/half white. Whats what you meant, right?

HighDemonslayer · Post by **HighDemonslayer** » 10 Feb 2004 14:28

Jeremy: So where are all those whiteys coming from every year?

Jeremy said:

-------------------------------------
My point is that ethnic majorities (usually white people) really have no idea why racism is so offensive and why the minorities have so much ill feeling towards them.
--------------------------------------

Nice generalization, What was that about about disguised racism?

-n

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 10 Feb 2004 16:18

if your aim in that last post was to demonstrate exactly what I was talking about, you achieved that admirably. I'm sure you can see the difference between locking up a person without charge for sometimes over 5 years in the middle of a desert, and expressing the view that most of the ethnic majorities in the main countries represented on this board are white. Canada, The US, Australia, Europe, New Zealand. Or perhaps they aren't. Am I wrong? What are the ethnic majorities of those countries? Arab? Indian?

There is an important difference between a statement like - "most Australians are White" and "Most white people are stupid"

Australia's population of illegal immigrants comes mainly from the UK, Europe and the US.

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 10 Feb 2004 16:33

Yeah sorry, I meant Mullato. i was thinking it was spelled like the cookie.

pill · Post by **pill** » 11 Feb 2004 22:59

Jeremy wrote:if your aim in that last post was to demonstrate exactly what I was talking about, you achieved that admirably. I'm sure you can see the difference between locking up a person without charge for sometimes over 5 years in the middle of a desert, and expressing the view that most of the ethnic majorities in the main countries represented on this board are white. Canada, The US, Australia, Europe, New Zealand. Or perhaps they aren't. Am I wrong? What are the ethnic majorities of those countries? Arab? Indian?

There is an important difference between a statement like - "most Australians are White" and "Most white people are stupid"

Australia's population of illegal immigrants comes mainly from the UK, Europe and the US.

i think he was refering to your point about white people have no idea why racism is so offensive, and the fact that that is generalizeng a whole race in a negative way. that may be true of a majority of white people but by no means all of them. it's my opinion that you don't have te expirience it directed at you to be disgusted at it. and even if you think that you have to expirience it directed at you just think about white people that are discriminated against such as gay white people. but you yourself did say that it'd be racist to say that all white people are racist. and about all the racist comments coming from white people and making assumptions. what about white people you've met that haven't made racist comments to you, i'm betting that there are a lot more of those than the ones who made the racist comments. i'm not trying to defend the racist people, i hate racism, nor am i trying to belittle racist incidents i'm just trying to say that just becasue i'm white that doesn't mean that i'm a racist or that i can't understand where you're coming form

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 12 Feb 2004 06:57

That's not what I said. I said that ethnic majorities don't have an idea what racism is. Please don't put words into my mouth.

HighDemonslayer · Post by **HighDemonslayer** » 12 Feb 2004 10:00

I think the confusion might be about the last half of this sentence:

---------------------------
My point is that ethnic majorities (usually white people) really have no idea why racism is so offensive and why the minorities have so much ill feeling towards them.
----------------------------

Is this supposed to mean the minorities ill-feelings are toward the racism itself, or the majority in general? or both?

I was just irked by what I perceived to be a generaliztion about whiteys . No big deal.

-n

Anyone want to hear the one about the Chinese and the Jewish pilot?
(it's tasteful)

pill · Post by **pill** » 12 Feb 2004 15:55

Jeremy wrote:That's not what I said. I said that ethnic majorities don't have an idea what racism is. Please don't put words into my mouth.

i didn't think i put words into your mouth, i'm pretty sure most of it is an acurate quote but i could be wrong, i was going off of the fact that you said ethnic majorities don't have an idea what racism is. that is a racist comment. it is a negative generalization about a race. even though that may be true for most white people(i don't really know if it is or not but it probably is) there are still many who know just how bad racism can be, such as my example with gay white people, they could know about being discriminated against first hand, etc etc blah blah blah, i'm bored with this topic.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 14 Feb 2004 08:16

pill wrote:i was going off of the fact that you said ethnic majorities don't have an idea what racism is. that is a racist comment. it is a negative generalization about a race.

Can I ask, do you belong to an ethnic majority? I think if you do, you are providing good evidence to back up my "racist" comment.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 14 Feb 2004 08:22

I just want to add that an ethinic majority is not a particular race. In almost all the places that are represented on this board, the ethinic majority is white - hence I said usually white. However the same problems with racism exist in every country, with every ethinic majority. You are accusing me of being racist towards every major race in the world... This is exactly what I'm talking about in the original comment and rather insulting that you can belittle my experiences of genuine racism by comparing it to psomething that is not aimed at any race. I really, really wish people would research before posting whatever the first thing that comes into their mind when trying to post a serious comment.

pill · Post by **pill** » 14 Feb 2004 11:30

pill wrote: i'm not trying to defend the racist people, i hate racism, nor am i trying to belittle racist incidents i'm just trying to say that just becasue i'm white that doesn't mean that i'm a racist or that i can't understand where you're coming form

note the i'm not trying to belittle racist incidents. i know that what you said isn't really bad racism at all, it's as tame as racism gets but it's still racist. i know that there are people who get beaten to death for the color of thier skin or what they believe in. i'm not saying that you're a horrable racict for saying that i'm just saying that it's funny that you put some racism into the post against racism.

p.s. and does aiming the comment about every ethnic majority make it worse or better? that's like if i were to insult all ethnic minorities instead of just a specific one. attacking one ethnic minority is bad and racist, but so is attacking them all, but attacking them all is insulting many more people

p.p.s. yes i do happen to be white, and i have also gotten into fights defending gay friends from dumb ass gay bashers

p.p.p.s. i hope you're not taking any of this personally because it's just a conversation, i don't mean any harm by any of it

dragonhack · Post by **dragonhack** » 16 Feb 2004 20:43

HighDemonslayer wrote:I think the confusion might be about the last half of this sentence:

---------------------------
My point is that ethnic majorities (usually white people) really have no idea why racism is so offensive and why the minorities have so much ill feeling towards them.
----------------------------

Is this supposed to mean the minorities ill-feelings are toward the racism itself, or the majority in general? or both?

I was just irked by what I perceived to be a generaliztion about whiteys . No big deal.

-n

Anyone want to hear the one about the Chinese and the Jewish pilot?
(it's tasteful)

------------------

im up for a joke!

Oh such bad words. Censorship?

How to deal with offensive written content?