the economy and frugal living
- Blue_turnip
- Egyptian Footgod
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Regarding the topic of the thread. What do you reckon the people working at the YMCA and the restaurants you'd otherwise visit are going to do when loads of people with the same idea as you stop spending?
The first sentence from wikipedia's article on "economy":
"The economy is the realised social system of production, exchange, distribution, and consumption of goods and services of a country or other area. "
So if you're not encouraging exchange, distribution, and consumption of goods and services, how is this economic problem going to be fixed? Its not just going to magically disappear by itself.
Additionally, you yourself said that you can continue to spend as you are without noticable problems. Its people who are in your position who should be getting out there and buying shit.
The first sentence from wikipedia's article on "economy":
"The economy is the realised social system of production, exchange, distribution, and consumption of goods and services of a country or other area. "
So if you're not encouraging exchange, distribution, and consumption of goods and services, how is this economic problem going to be fixed? Its not just going to magically disappear by itself.
Additionally, you yourself said that you can continue to spend as you are without noticable problems. Its people who are in your position who should be getting out there and buying shit.
Oliver Adams
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- Blue_turnip
- Egyptian Footgod
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Nothing I said had anything to do with giving tax cuts to rich people.crazylegs32 wrote:That trickle down economics was just a scam anyways. You expect rob to stretch his families resources in troubled times in order to prevent economic collapse/ LOL
Neither did I suggest he 'stretch his family resources in troubled times'. My suggestion was based on him saying "my family can continue our current spend patterns without noticeable problems". I merely suggest that he doesn't stop spending the way he currently does.
Do you have any backing for that claim?crazylegs32 wrote:The only way out is to stop the debt based economy.
Last edited by Blue_turnip on 28 Dec 2008 14:34, edited 1 time in total.
Oliver Adams
- QuantumBalance
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- Blue_turnip
- Egyptian Footgod
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- QuantumBalance
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Jeremy wrote: If in 1 year Jeremy is unemployed and struggling to get food that he hadn't previously stored away, or if there is a very severe economic depression but Jeremy used his intellect and/or government/family connections to avoid suffering then he will send Dan 20 cans of Campbell's Beef and Barley soup. If, however, Jeremy is still employed at this time and there is no economic depression to the extent that hoarding canned food and buying guns is an advantage to people, Dan will send Jeremy $20 USD.
I just wanted to add that there is a reasonable chance that in one years time I will be studying full time, so only working a little bit, or maybe not at all, but relying on government welfare and scholarships to sustain myself. If the Australian government is still willing to pay people for studying at University to a level where it is possible to support myself independently, I think this should count as being employed and will be a clear indication that any economic downturn is not as severe as Dan is suggesting.
So I clearly won this bet. Dan owes me $20 plus $60 AUD for the cans of soup. Of course I had even less faith in Dan ever paying up on this bet than I did on Matt Cross paying up on his 10 bags, but it's a pretty good demonstration that he had absolutely no idea what he was talking about in his first post, which is demonstrated by his general lack of substantiated content in most of his posts about serious issues, which is juxtaposed by my content reliant posts. Indeed my policy on modified has always been to only post about topics where I already have a lot of interest, have done the research and feel like I know what I'm talking about, and I often feel that when people say that I "like debating" they're confusing debating with caring about truth on a topic I have done a lot of research on amongst people who have done very little. Lawyers and politicians try to win arguments no matter what. Scientists evaluate the evidence and then form a conclusion based on where that points. I don't debate using "skill," I debate using real content, and I hope this bet made that clear.
I take great pride in my diabolical setup here... I made it look like I was starting one conversation, but really it was all a setup to make it so that soup pictures could exist and we could all be entertained. Somebody, please make me a permanent fixture in the hall of FAME thread for my genius in this matter.
Bob R.
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- Egyptian Footgod
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Ok, first of all I lack a complete understanding of this steaming shit pile of a mess. Everyone is out there making money off "interest" through their "investments".
But they arent investing in things which are an "input" to the system. Investors seem to lack integrity and only invest to profit, regardless of what happens after they get theirs- that kinda system belongs in the garbage. Things like labor, crops, and energy are all "inputs" to the system. So all these lazy fatasses are getting rich off their so called "investments" in which they are really investing other peoples money.
Where do their profits come from? How can everyone investing make 10% a year off doing nothing? They just print more money The system cant work without more input to make up for all the interest being payed out. So more and more money is printed.
But they arent investing in things which are an "input" to the system. Investors seem to lack integrity and only invest to profit, regardless of what happens after they get theirs- that kinda system belongs in the garbage. Things like labor, crops, and energy are all "inputs" to the system. So all these lazy fatasses are getting rich off their so called "investments" in which they are really investing other peoples money.
Where do their profits come from? How can everyone investing make 10% a year off doing nothing? They just print more money The system cant work without more input to make up for all the interest being payed out. So more and more money is printed.
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- Egyptian Footgod
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- max
- Australofrenchbrityorkus
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*scratches head*crazylegs32 wrote:Ok, first of all I lack a complete understanding of this steaming shit pile of a mess. Everyone is out there making money off "interest" through their "investments".
But they arent investing in things which are an "input" to the system. Investors seem to lack integrity and only invest to profit, regardless of what happens after they get theirs- that kinda system belongs in the garbage. Things like labor, crops, and energy are all "inputs" to the system. So all these lazy fatasses are getting rich off their so called "investments" in which they are really investing other peoples money.
Where do their profits come from? How can everyone investing make 10% a year off doing nothing? They just print more money The system cant work without more input to make up for all the interest being payed out. So more and more money is printed.
what precisely are you talking about?
Maxime Boucoiran
French ConneXion
BFC
French ConneXion
BFC
Good thread Bob.
Entertaining insight Jeremy. (Soup cans had me rolling - ham and pea soup? really? that's nasty! lol)
On topic:
What I have done to help during the recession:
1.) Cut spending on more expensive dinners. Basically Ken is correct about not spending and consumer confidence, which is why we still spend money out, we just spread it around smaller less expensive venues rather than unloading a wad at a pricey restaurant.
2.) Shop goodwill for clothing. I generally haven't cared about fashion since high school, so clothing has taken a back seat. I can usually find name brand clothing at thrift stores anyways, so this is really a good solution even in good economic times.
3.) Contrary to popular belief - Bought a car!!! While larger purchases should be a no no, it actually lifts the economy to do so. In the process I was able to save $300/mo. trading in the gas guzzler for the smaller more affordable cross-over. Also saved an additional $250 in gas.
4.) No central heating. We have opted for limited house heating vs. auto thermostat and no longer use the gas fireplace as a heating source. Instead we use 1 space heater for up to an hour at a time and no central heating. This has saved about $200 on the heating bill (our house is big and has a lot of leaks).
5.) Cut back on pool chemicals and run time. This requires more physical cleanings but saves on overall maintenance. Swimming pools can cost up to $200 a month if not properly maintained.
6.) Use budgeting software to set limits. I recently got a cool little Pocket Money app on my iTouch that allows me to keep track of spending on the go. This little utility has done wonders for budgeting expenses and keeping money in the green rather than the red.
Here are things that have been done at work:
1.) Mandatory PTO. By making employees take PTO they alleviate the overhead associated with benefit costs.
2.) Company shut down at Christmas. Part of the mandatory PTO was taking 2 weeks at Christmas. This has both negative and positive effects, but at the end of the day saves the company money.
3.) Scaled back corporate functions. Example: no company parties this year.
4.) Slow to hire when employees resign. When an employee leaves the company, the company is slow to react and rehire, which keeps costs down.
5.) Merit freeze. No pay raises this year or the next.
The good news is that I have a job, so I am at least in the 89+% of the work force. My entire family, minus Dad and brother are all on unemployment and have been for the past 3-6 months. So folks got it bad in this recession, and I am thankful to be skilled and have a job.
~peace
Entertaining insight Jeremy. (Soup cans had me rolling - ham and pea soup? really? that's nasty! lol)
On topic:
What I have done to help during the recession:
1.) Cut spending on more expensive dinners. Basically Ken is correct about not spending and consumer confidence, which is why we still spend money out, we just spread it around smaller less expensive venues rather than unloading a wad at a pricey restaurant.
2.) Shop goodwill for clothing. I generally haven't cared about fashion since high school, so clothing has taken a back seat. I can usually find name brand clothing at thrift stores anyways, so this is really a good solution even in good economic times.
3.) Contrary to popular belief - Bought a car!!! While larger purchases should be a no no, it actually lifts the economy to do so. In the process I was able to save $300/mo. trading in the gas guzzler for the smaller more affordable cross-over. Also saved an additional $250 in gas.
4.) No central heating. We have opted for limited house heating vs. auto thermostat and no longer use the gas fireplace as a heating source. Instead we use 1 space heater for up to an hour at a time and no central heating. This has saved about $200 on the heating bill (our house is big and has a lot of leaks).
5.) Cut back on pool chemicals and run time. This requires more physical cleanings but saves on overall maintenance. Swimming pools can cost up to $200 a month if not properly maintained.
6.) Use budgeting software to set limits. I recently got a cool little Pocket Money app on my iTouch that allows me to keep track of spending on the go. This little utility has done wonders for budgeting expenses and keeping money in the green rather than the red.
Here are things that have been done at work:
1.) Mandatory PTO. By making employees take PTO they alleviate the overhead associated with benefit costs.
2.) Company shut down at Christmas. Part of the mandatory PTO was taking 2 weeks at Christmas. This has both negative and positive effects, but at the end of the day saves the company money.
3.) Scaled back corporate functions. Example: no company parties this year.
4.) Slow to hire when employees resign. When an employee leaves the company, the company is slow to react and rehire, which keeps costs down.
5.) Merit freeze. No pay raises this year or the next.
The good news is that I have a job, so I am at least in the 89+% of the work force. My entire family, minus Dad and brother are all on unemployment and have been for the past 3-6 months. So folks got it bad in this recession, and I am thankful to be skilled and have a job.
~peace
Go out and shred already.
~Damon Mathews
~Damon Mathews