Shin splints and calcium

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Shin splints and calcium

Post by Seath » 03 Aug 2004 22:09

So I searched google for info on getting rid of shin splints and I came across
http://mi.eng.cam.ac.uk/~kmk/shin_splint.html

Somewhere down near the bottom someone says
I developed shin splints some time ago (1988) and I put up with them for a few years . Sometimes the pain was rather intense ,even when walking. Anyway, I joined a martial arts club and trained for a while then a person I trained with noticed I was in pain walking and when I told him it was from shin splints He said he had a way to get rid of them in about a week.

As you can imagine ,after putting up with it for do long I was skeptical as to his claims. He said to go to a health store and get some Calcium Ascorbate tablets and take two of them twice a day and the splints will go.

Sounds too easy doesn't it. I thought what the hell may as well try it ,at least I'll put off the osteoporosis for a while. I bought the tablets for about $10 and took them. This is no bull ,the splints were gone in three days. I finished all the tablets just to make sure. This was 5 years ago now and I run more than I ever did before and I have never had a recurrence of splints.

Every person I come across with splints gets this advice and every single one who tries it is amazed.
So I figured hey thats a pretty good idea. But do you guys think that this would be a cure for split sufferers who just dont get enough calcium or would the overdose on calcium have something to do with it?

I get tonnes of calcium a day I loooove milk. Im wondering if I try this will it really do anything for me? Someone who already is getting the reccomended daily intake of calcium?
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Post by lightningbolt » 03 Aug 2004 23:50

Yeah, I get the "recommend" amount of calcium and I have never got shin splits. But then again I realllly suck, and maybe I don't shred hard enough to get 'em. Who knows? It would be something to look into. Ask your doctor about it.
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Post by bigdirtyfoot » 04 Aug 2004 04:14

I definitely get shin splints. I definitely drink enough milk (Is a gallon a day, or a gallon every two days, good enough?). I may try these calcium pills later on. Btw, I wanted to throw this up here... a musician friend of mine recently told me to go to http://www.notmilk.com/ and see all of the information there. I'll be going there later today. Just figured I'd share it with you guys.
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Post by King Monkey » 04 Aug 2004 04:42

hmm id research these tablets a little more before taking them... ive read that exact paragraph before when researching shin splint cures and i remember someone responding to this tablet that it was not recommended as a remedy for shin splints... i think something about it being a 'band-aid cure' and not actually preventing the shin splints occuring or something like that

not sure of details but id be doubly sure about it before taking them.. maybe consult ur local doctor
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Post by brian relly » 04 Aug 2004 07:34

lol.

Milk drains calcium from your body, will all the magnesium it puts in. You're much better off taking calcium pills.

Yes, go to the website David posted. My stepdad is a chiropractor and had to learn all of the same things about nutrition while he was going through school. Now the only time I ever drink milk is like in my cereal or my eggs in the morning.
Drinking all that milk every day can be really hard on your body.
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Post by Seath » 04 Aug 2004 09:01

really. Thats so shocking to me, I've always been told the opposite. I drink alot of milk just cuz I think its so tasty
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Post by brian relly » 04 Aug 2004 09:05

I think the taste is okay, but in my opinion it's nothing special. Any time I drink a glass of milk, though, it fucks over my digestive system. That's the main reason I stay away from it. My stepdad could tell you a lot more because he's actually studied all of this. All I know is the propaganda that has been preached to me.
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Post by ptaku » 04 Aug 2004 10:16

I heard (and I think that it is good theory), that milk is healthyin toung age. But if someone is older then it isn't so fine...
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Post by brian relly » 04 Aug 2004 10:28

Human breast milk is (when you're little), but not cow milk.
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Post by ptaku » 04 Aug 2004 10:33

and the best source of Calcium are Danonki (I now that you don't know what I'm talking about :P) :P Cheese is good source too.
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Post by Seath » 04 Aug 2004 10:38

im wating grilled cheese sandwiches right now.. mmm mmm mmm
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Post by Prenz » 13 Aug 2004 18:31

Stephen Barnes wrote:I think the taste is okay, but in my opinion it's nothing special. Any time I drink a glass of milk, though, it fucks over my digestive system. That's the main reason I stay away from it.
Dude... u can't handle milk... fine.

Don't tell people milk isn't a source of calcium, just because it is mean to your particular screwy body :lol: That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. I'll listen to my doctor and not Dr. Barnes.
Stephen Barnes wrote:Human breast milk is, but not cow milk.
I'd like to hear a breakdown of the chemical differences between the two, Dr. Barnes. Specifically how one version of mammal milk "drains calcium" from the body, while the other mammal milk does not. Funny how milk can make big strong cow bones while simultaneously draining its calcium, a building block of bone. 8O That statement should get a paradox add!

-----EDIT Lets see what Harvard has to say:

What are calcium sources?

The body gets the calcium it needs in two ways. One is by eating foods that have calcium, such as dairy products--which have the highest concentration per serving of highly absorbable calcium.


http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionso ... lcium.html

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Post by Jeremy » 13 Aug 2004 20:44

That may be so. However according to the Institute For Complimentary Medicine Journal:
As detailed earlier in this article, pasteurisation (of cow milk) causes the loss of:
enzymes
water-soluble vitamins
mineral-carrying whey proteins which help absorb the minerals
other whey proteins such as lactoferrin which help to promote healthy gut bacteria in the neonates
solubility of calcium, thus decreasing absorption
potentially beneficial bacteria
bacteriostatic mechanisms which help protect against infectious organisms.
So if you are looking for more calcium and don't live next to a dairy, I suggest you look at sources other than milk. Not that I'm a doctor - but I'm going on information from a number of doctors and scientists who may know as much about the subject as Dr. Prenz...

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Post by Jeremy » 13 Aug 2004 20:53

Sorry for the double post. Here is some more information about calcium and milk.
Not Milk Propaganda website wrote: Human breast milk is Mother Nature's PERFECT FORMULA for baby humans. Even dairy industry scientists would not be foolish enough to debate this UNIVERSALLY ACCEPTED FACT. In her wisdom, Mother Nature included 33 milligrams of calcium in every 100 grams, or 3 1/2-ounce portion of human breast milk.

Adults do not drink human breast milk. At the end of this column is a list of calcium values in the foods we eat. Each food is compared to human breast milk as the standard. You might be surprised to learn how many foods naturally contain an abundance of calcium. One must wonder why Asians traditionally did not get bone-crippling osteoporosis...that is, until they adopted the "American Diet," a diet of milk and dairy products.

The dairy industry owns the psychological exclusive rights to calcium in foods found in super markets. Few food manufacturers would dare to compete with the dairy message which infers that no other foods contain the calcium contained in milk, and without milk and dairy products you're certain to one day end up with bone-crippling osteoporosis. Tropicana Orange Juice has been marketing a Fruit-Cal orange juice which, according to the Tropicana company, contains a more absorbable type of calcium than other calcium supplements. Each cup of Tropicana's pure premium calcium contains 350 milligrams of calcium as opposed to only 302 in one cup of milk and 172 in one ounce of American cheese. Minute Maid also has a Calcium-Orange Juice product and claims that it contains fifteen times the amount of calcium as contained in an equivalent sample of regular orange juice. Gerber's Baby cereal sells a box of single grain barley upon which they write, "An excellent source of iron and a good source of calcium." The side panel of their box reveals that their cereal contains barley flour and tri and di calcium phosphate. Other than orange juice and baby food, no visible claim to calcium is made by any food manufacturer. The reason, of course, is that milk holds the monopoly. They hold title to and make claim to America's calcium perception. Few would dare challenge that claim.

A tour through a typical American supermarket reveals aisles dedicated to specific food groups...There are fresh fruits and vegetables in one section and meats and poultry in another. Rice and grains are kept separate from beans and canned vegetables. Milk and dairy products (which represent America's most sought after foods) are usually placed furthest from the market's front door. Junk foods are conjointly placed in the same aisle with cookies and potato chips. These high calorie/low fiber snacks are stacked within walking distance of both artificially sweetened and high sugar sodas.

Hostess Twinkies contain calcium. Those golden sponge cakes with creamy fillings are as much a part of our cuisine as they are a part of our national culture. To many, Twinkies represent all that is artificial and unhealthy about our collective fast food diet. To others they epitomize instant snacks, a quick source of energy and mother's easy-to-prepare dessert for her school-age child. When I was in college, Twinkies represented one of the four major food groups (along with French fries, alcoholic beverages and McDonald's hamburgers.) To read a Twinkies ingredient label is to marvel at how far mankind has progressed these past twenty-five thousand years, eating fruits and nuts and vegetables and grains, and occasional mastodon steaks, to:


"Enriched wheat flour, (niacin, a "B" vitamin), ferrous sulfate (iron), thiamin mononitrate (B1), riboflavin (B2), water, sugar, corn syrup, high fructose corn syrup, partially hydrogenated vegetable and/or animal shortening (contains one or more of: canola, corn, cottonseed or soybean oil, beef fat), eggs, dextrose. Contains 2% or less of: modified food starch, whey, leavenings (sodium and pyrophosphate, baking soda, monocalcium phosphate), salt, starch, yellow corn flour, corn syrup solids, emulsifiers mono and diglycerides, lecithin, polysorbate 60, dextrin, calcium caseinate, sodium stearoyl, lactylate, cellulose gum, wheat gluten, natural and artificial flavors, caramel color, artificial colors (yellow 5, red 40), sorbic acid (to retain freshness)."

The Dairy Industry and milk processors invest hundreds of millions of dollars each year to guarantee that Americans will continue to drink milk and eat dairy products, investing their money to continually let Americans know that milk tastes good and the intake of milk and dairy products must be continued to insure good health. Milk mustaches are stylish. Drink milk and you're beautiful! Gorgeous models, actors, actresses, sports heroes, even President Clinton and Bob Dole have posed for milk advertisements. All have asserted by the milky white goo artificially applied to their upper lip that drinking milk is healthful and wholesome. Who would argue with such an overwhelming endorsement? Billboards spanning America ask the question, "Got milk?" Cal Ripken of the Baltimore Orioles broke Lou Gehrig's record for consecutive major league baseball games played. Ripken, holding a baseball bat, smiles from inside the front cover of a "GOT MILK" brochure proclaiming, "With all the skim milk I drink, my name might as well be Calcium Ripken, Jr."

Common knowledge of osteoporosis is based upon false assumptions. American women have been drinking an average of two pounds of milk or eating the equivalent milk in dairy products per day for their entire lives. Doctors recommend calcium intake for increasing and maintaining bone strength and bone density which they call bone mass. According to this regimen recommended by doctors and milk industry executives, women's bone mass would approach that of pre-historic dinosaurs. This line of reasoning should be equally extinct. Twenty-five million American women have osteoporosis. Drinking milk does not prevent osteoporosis. Milk contains calcium. Bones contain calcium too. When we are advised to add calcium to our diets we tend to drink milk or eat dairy foods.

In order to absorb calcium, the body needs comparable amounts of another mineral element, magnesium. Milk and dairy products contain only small amounts of magnesium. Without the presence of magnesium, the body only absorbs 25 percent of the available dairy calcium content. The remainder of the calcium spells trouble. Without magnesium, excess calcium is utilized by the body in injurious ways. The body uses calcium to build the mortar on arterial walls which becomes atherosclerotic plaques. Excess calcium is converted by the kidneys into painful stones which grow in size like pearls in oysters, blocking our urinary tracts. Excess calcium contributes to arthritis; painful calcium buildup often is manifested as gout. The USDA has formulated a chart of recommended daily intakes of vitamins and minerals. The term that FDA uses is Recommended Daily Allowance (RDA). The RDA for calcium is 1500 mg. The RDA for magnesium is 750 mg.

Society stresses the importance of calcium, but rarely magnesium. Yet, magnesium is vital to enzymatic activity. In addition to insuring proper absorption of calcium, magnesium is critical to proper neural and muscular function and to maintaining proper pH balance in the body. Magnesium, along with vitamin B6 (pyridoxine), helps to dissolve calcium phosphate stones which often accumulate from excesses of dairy intake. Good sources of magnesium include beans, green leafy vegetables like kale and collards, whole grains and orange juice. Non-dairy sources of calcium include green leafy vegetables, almonds, asparagus, broccoli, cabbage, oats, beans, parsley, sesame seeds and tofu.

Osteoporosis is NOT a problem that should be associated with lack of calcium intake. Osteoporosis results from calcium loss. The massive amounts of protein in milk result in a 50 percent loss of calcium in the urine. In other words, by doubling your protein intake there will be a loss of 1-1.5 percent in skeletal mass per year in postmenopausal women. The calcium contained in leafy green vegetables is more easily absorbed than the calcium in milk, and plant proteins do not result in calcium loss the same way as do animal proteins. If a postmenopausal woman loses 1-1.5 percent bone mass per year, what will be the effect after 20 years? When osteoporosis occurs levels of calcium (being excreted from the bones)in the blood are high. Milk only adds to these high levels of calcium which is excreted or used by the body to add to damaging atherosclerosis, gout, kidney stones, etc.

Bone mass does not increase after age 35. This is a biological fact that is not in dispute by scientists. However, this fact is ignored by marketing geniuses in the milk industry who make certain that women this age and older are targeted consumers for milk and dairy products. At least one in four women will suffer from osteoporosis with fractures of the ribs, hip or forearm. In 1994, University of Texas researchers published results of an experiment indicating that supplemental calcium is ineffective in preventing bone loss. Within 5 years of the initial onset of menopause, there is an accelerated rate of loss of bone, particularly from the spine. During this period of time, estrogen replacement is most effective in preventing rapid bone density loss.

Bone Mass is Genetically Determined

In December of 1994 a study, published in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, revealed that skeletal size and bone mass are genetically programmed. Optimal skeletal size is achieved through adequate calcium intake in an individual's youth. However, excess calcium has an effect upon bone mass. Once enough calcium is introduced, the excess is either excreted in the urine or absorbed by the kidneys, arteries and liver. This excess calcium can cause great damage. The decrease in skeletal mass associated with osteoporosis in women is primarily caused by the age-dependent decrease in hormonal steroid secretion by the ovaries. While optimal calcium intake in childhood and adolescence is important for achieving proper bone density, calcium intake in adulthood has little significance.

An overview based upon recent findings regarding the pathogenesis of osteoporosis was published in Germany in 1994 and translated into English where the abstract appeared on MEDLINE, a computer service containing scientific abstracts of research. The premise of this study is that osteoporosis is an unavoidable consequence of aging for which no prevention was previously possible. However, recent hormonal therapies have slowed down the process of rapid bone loss. The lack of estrogen and progesterone play an important role in the development of osteoporosis.

Human breast milk contains 33 milligrams of calcium per 100-gram portion and potato chips contain 40 milligrams!
Sorry for the size - I hope you read it all though - not that I'm trying to stop you from drinking milk - I've got a good friend who doesn't drink milk and has told me all this stuff years ago and I still drink milk.

I don't think it's mentioned in the article but American women have the drink more milk per person than in any other country, yet also have the highest rate of osteoporosis according to http://www.notmilk.com

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Post by Prenz » 13 Aug 2004 21:01

Alright...

First, good research. Secondly, it may be true that pasteurizing milk will decrease the solubility of the calcium it contains. I've read that only 30% of the milk's calcium from cow milk gets absorbed due to this. But to state that drinking milk actually ROBS YOU of calcium is just dumb.

Here's another fact for you... people that drink TOO much milk get osteoporosis. Why? Because it causes your bone-building mechanisms to OVERACT, depositing TOO MUCH calcium, thus making them age quicker than they should. Not to say that drinking milk isnt good... drinking too much isn't.

(Consuming too much water can be bad for you too... even kill you. Some soldiers in IRAQ died of drinking too much water, as they were instructed to do. It caused cells to swell and burst. That does NOT mean don't drink water, "because it will rob you of H2O" :lol: ).

The lesson: you may get shin splints if u don't get enough calcium in your diet. If you don't get enough calcium in your diet, consuming dairy products can help. It will NOT steal away calcium and hurt you. Don't overdo the dairy intake, because too much of anything WILL hurt you.

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Post by Jas » 14 Aug 2004 23:37

yeh my dad always told me not to drink too much milk, he didnt tell me y so i ignored him. But after reading this, i understand now which is pretty interesting.
Would there be any kind of food or health pills which contain both magnesium and calcium? If there is, well then that would be perfect for shin splints and bone growth.
Just an idea, if your going to the chemist or supermarket next time, check for health pills which contains both magnesium and calcium...
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Post by ville » 15 Aug 2004 00:33

On the topic: Shin Splints are not allways caused by micro fractions in the bone. Sometimes it's caused by the muscles in the shin area being too small for their task. This type of shin splits will just dissappear when your legs get stronger. Then there is one type of shin splits where the "muscle bag" your calf muscle is in is too small for the muscle and causing the pain. In this case you need surgery to make the "muscle bag" bigger.

I'm not very good in medical talk in english :roll:

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Post by Jeremy » 15 Aug 2004 02:00

Totally. That's what I found - as soon as I built up my calf muscles my shin splints went away and haven't come back. I'm a little disturbed to find out that my high protien diet may be weakening my bones, but considering the amount of calcium I get, it's probably ok (I hope so anyway). It's very hard to truely eat a healthy diet I think...

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Post by Jas » 15 Aug 2004 03:50

yeh most footbaggers have shin splints on their left leg, so thats probably a sign of the calf muscle not strong enough to support the bone. I myself have very slight pains through my left leg but none on my right. And now im working on a couple of exercises that flex the front lower leg muscles(muscles beside and around the bone) and the calf muscles.
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Post by brian relly » 15 Aug 2004 05:20

My chiropractor tells me that it's the muscles around my shins getting to *big* and compressing the bone, which makes it hurt. Usually this only happens on days when you kick for hours at a time, throughout the day, and those muscles get overworked and swell up around the bone. Whenever this happens, I rest and sleep it off, and in the morning the swelling has gone down and it feels fine again.
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