Lavers unModified?

Champ · Post by **Champ** » 16 Sep 2009 12:13

Another newbish question I have...
I plan on getting a pair of Lavers. Do they work good for footbag unmodified? I don't really want to cut up my shoes, so if they still work than I'll probably get them. And if they don't work unmodified, are there any other shoes I can get in a chain store that are good for footbag that don't need to be modified? Thanks!

Toasty · Post by **Toasty** » 16 Sep 2009 12:48

Yes, they work unmodified.

mc · Post by mc » 16 Sep 2009 13:20

I disagree with Brandin. The question is not "do they work", it is "do they work good"?

If they worked well without modification, you'd see a LOT more players using them without modification. I've only seen one modern advanced player using unmodded lavers for shred and in competition, and I also saw that same player drop some easy moves because the bag rolled off the unmodified toe at crucial points in competition.

So, can it be done? Yes. but you could also hit a baseball pretty far with a piece of unmodified 4x4 maple, but, to me, that's not good enough reason to skip modification.

Champ, you should really read this thread called "I'm just getting started, what should I do first?" -http://modified.in/footbag/viewtopic.php?t=10252

that would answer a lot of these questions that you (and me as well

) refer to as "newbish".

Also, one more note... the basic toe mod (where you cut the box of stitches that attach the sides of the shoe to the toe area, and then re-lace) is completely reversible.

If you just cut those stitches, you can lace the shoe normally and it looks exactly the same. So, there's no risk to trying the basic toe mod. If you like it, you can decide to try more mods.

(also, Brandin, I think there's something to be said for waiting until you've gained some more experience before you answer posted questions by other less experienced players)

Champ · Post by **Champ** » 16 Sep 2009 13:54

Alright, thanks. If I didn't know I would have gone off and bought some, but I don't want to cut my shoes. And if I don't do a good job on the cutting, I wasted fifty bucks. Does anyone have any other suggestions of shoes I can get in chain stores? And sorry if I'm annoying anyone...

mc · Post by mc » 16 Sep 2009 14:16

if you think you can take a pair of normal office scissors and cut the little pieces of string (not leather, mesh, plastic, etc) that hold two pieces of material together, you can handle the toe mod.

If you go slowly and carefully, you will not ruin your shoes. If you make a small mistake, you will not ruin your shoes.

If you're interested in trying something that is pretty good, and requires no mods, maybe consider the macbeth manchester. Or, you can pre-order a set of the nucleus (nucleusfootwear.com), but I don't know when those are coming out. Hopefully soon.

Lavers are the best thing out there right now, and I don't know of a shoe that requires no modding and also plays as close to as well as a pair of modded lavers.

You can get by without modding your lavers, or by trying some other shoe, but do you want to "get by"? or do you want to play with decent equipment and hit decent moves with decent style?

It's cool to be nervous about modding your shoes. i think everyone is the first time, but it's really nothing to worry about. it's as easy as slowly cutting little pieces of string.

slapdash21 · Post by **slapdash21** » 16 Sep 2009 14:42

POP DAT CHERRY.

you'll be glad you did, i promise.

g00d33 · Post by **g00d33** » 16 Sep 2009 14:46

Hey, I was really really nervous about cutting up my lavers when I first got them too. In fact, the only mod I did to my lavers for a long time was the lacing. I didn't even cut the stitches. BUT, when I finally did cut the stitches, I noticed a really big difference.

When I was cutting them, I was practically afraid that the universe would collapse. But to my delight, cutting the stitches was overly easy. It's nearly impossible to mess up on. And plus, like Matt said, you can just lace the shoes normal again and it's as though nothing happened.

Trust us, you won't regret it!

Champ · Post by **Champ** » 16 Sep 2009 15:45

I am really considering getting a pair of Macbath's. They look like they would suit my needs: footbag/handsack, and skateboarding. But do you think that the Macbeth Eliot would be as good, if not better? To me they look like the top is more flat, but I don't know what your opinion is.
PS: Sorry if my questions/posts are getting annoying...[/url]

Champ · Post by **Champ** » 16 Sep 2009 15:49

Oh, or possibly the Macbeth Wallister's...

And sorry for the double post (if it's against the rules... better read those!)

Toasty · Post by **Toasty** » 16 Sep 2009 17:33

There are no pairs of shoes that can do well both skateboarding AND footbag. Take it from me. I used to skate then started footbag. While skate shoes were fine to kick in, they didn't suffice for freestyle. And then I got my first pair of lavers. You can't skate in tennis shoes (you can, but it's not a wise choice). That's actually how I broke my ankle. If I had been wearingy skate shoes that wouldn't have happened. It would be best to get two pairs of shoes: one for footbag and one for skating.

mc · Post by mc » 16 Sep 2009 17:58

I've seen those models. If you're going to get a Macbeth for footbag, I say go with Manchester. The Manchester is practically the same as laver, except the toe box is smaller and the inside is rounder (both negatives compared to the laver). The sole is also slipperier. The only plus is they're lighter.

WyrmFyre · Post by **WyrmFyre** » 16 Sep 2009 23:19

Step 1 : Buy Lavers

Step 2 : Do the toe box mod and relace

Step 3 : Never look back

Honestly, the toe box mod is so easy, and yes its reversible just by lacing the shoes back normally. The topic of footwear is an often discussed topic among beginners, I too jumped on the bandwagon looking for alternatives not too long back, but its well worth biding your time until you can get some.

Check eBay regularly. I got a pair from there in great condition for under a third of the price I would have paid new, and now the only thing that would dissuade me from playing with them is the off chance I could afford to get my hands on a pair of Nucleus.

hrdcorethndr1 · Post by **hrdcorethndr1** » 18 Sep 2009 07:06

i dont think you should worry about your lavers being destroyed if you mod them, i have never had a problom with the durability of my modded lavers, the bottom of my last pair of shoes had almost lost all of its green color and the rest of the shoe still held together just fine (this is with toe box mod and later the inside side (not sure what this is called) mod. so basically what i am saying is if you can follow matt cross's mod instructions than your shoes will still last.

Champ · Post by **Champ** » 30 Sep 2009 17:18

I actually ended up getting Etnies RVLs. They're quite good for footbag, as well as skateboarding.

Slowsis · Post by **Slowsis** » 01 Oct 2009 15:02

This topic is a bit funny, as i just spent an hour doing every possible mod to my new lavers (which I got from Andrew Dunford).

Toe walls removed.
Relaced
Broka'd
Canvas from toe and instep removed.

Always worth it.

Wasabi · Post by **Wasabi** » 01 Oct 2009 20:58

Rod Lavers will do you good. Take the risk in modding them.

Life is full of risks.

PS: The Macbeth Manchesters have a pretty good clipper. Not as ideal as the Rod Laver or the Quantum, but they're not horrible and you can clipper fine with them.

Cod · Post by **Cod** » 02 Oct 2009 17:01

Worth mentioning:

Last year Footbag Routines World Champion and this year Footbag Routines World Vice-Champion Damian Gielnicki uses unmodified Lavers.

mc · Post by mc » 02 Oct 2009 21:06

and in response, a little self-quote -

If they worked well without modification, you'd see a LOT more players using them without modification. I've only seen one modern advanced player using unmodded lavers for shred and in competition, and I also saw that same player drop some easy moves because the bag rolled off the unmodified toe at crucial points in competition.

Damian's incredible. Absolutely a great player. However, his toe stall spot is not as incredible as he is.

Swizzle · Post by **Swizzle** » 03 Oct 2009 12:14

I have never seen those nucleus.. how light are they and does the canvas layer make a difference rather than a thin mesh layer.. (quantums and mod'd lavers)

My opionion on all of this, and i am fairly new too, i wanted to see both the quantum and the lavers and see which ones were better. THEN, i wanted to see if that toe box thing really did anything, so i modefied the lavers, and kept the quantums tied regularly.. I liked the quantums at first, the toe box was irritating. After a while i fell in love with the lavers, because the toe box i got used to and the clipper spot seemed incredible. THEN, when i used the quantums next, i had messed up toe stalls way too much, and when i went back to lavers, i did good again.. THEN, i opened up the toe box on my quantums cause couldnt stand not having it, and it was incredible....

To sum up, didnt like at first, started to like more, now i can't live without because i do so much better with.. Also i should add with that toe box it inforces that you do a proper pixie set, not rolling it off your foot, which may only help me, but i thought id mention it.

MJK · Post by **MJK** » 30 Oct 2009 09:19

if you're really concerned about messing up your shoes you can use a small hook for the toe cut. it's easier and there's zero risk