specific laver mod question

TokenHippie · Post by **TokenHippie** » 07 May 2011 17:27

Greeting all, joined up yesterday, returned to footbag 2 weeks ago, got my lavers on thursday. It feels good to be back but I digress; when you have gotten a pair of lavers is it necessary to remove the inner layer where you would do your inside/ outside stalls. For those that have how beneficial is that really? I have already done shoe lace mods and cut the stitching to open up the toe box (done wonders) and am always looking for a way to get a leg up for kicking and shred. I just don't wanna have to do a shoe mod that's not necessary. Feedback my dudes!

sen · Post by **sen** » 07 May 2011 17:51

Is it necessary? No. You don't have to do anything.

Is it beneficial? YES!

It leaves you with a very thin layer of fabric that allows you to feel the bag through the shoe and reduces bounce off that might happen from the two materials having less "give" than the one thin one.

My suggestion: Play the shoes as you have them now. It took me 6 months to get up the courage to cut the insides out of my first pair, and if you are mostly kicking right now, it won't make a huge difference. Eventually, you will want to cut out that inside layer, but for now... no rush.

TokenHippie · Post by **TokenHippie** » 07 May 2011 18:37

Thank you so much that really helps, when I played before I stopped I was not too advanced, I knew toe and inside (not proficiently) and ATW only one way on one leg. So I'm pretty much just restarting and right now I'm trying to get up to a record of 100 alternating kicks. I can still do toe and inside stalls but I want to get the kicks mastered before moving on.

PoisonTaffy · Post by **PoisonTaffy** » 07 May 2011 21:15

I've heard an advice to cut only the inner double layer. Supposedly cutting both inner and outer may shorten the shoe's life span. I've never cut the outer so I don't really know.

When you do cut, also do the toe stall area (the "toe box"). It's a bitch to cut but so worth it.

mc · Post by mc » 07 May 2011 22:12

I cut off the outer layer instead of the inner layer. It's a lot easier to do that mod, and the inner layer is very grippy. It also becomes very soft over time.

I don't think cutting off either the inner or outer layer is necessary.

I don't recommend cutting off either layer on the "outside stall" surface - you want a lot of structural stability there in your shoe because your foot is going to push out in that direction, and also because you may find that side of your foot scraping against the ground when you are learning swirls.

kam · Post by **kam** » 17 May 2011 11:14

i'm not really a pro, but here are my thoughts...hopefully it may be of some use:

Uncut
- less work
- forces you to have better form/timing

[youtube]Cutting inner layer[/youtube]
- harder to mod
- looks cleaner
- better than uncut for stalls

Cutting outer layer
- easier to mod
- doesn't look as nice/clean (unless you put more work, which defeats the purpose of being easier to mod)
- better grip
- softer than only cutting inner layer

Cutting both layers
- more work (have to glue/stitch an extra layer of fabric)
- looks vary on how you mod
- may provide better grip (depending on fabric material)
- can shorten lifespan of shoes if cut too close to the edges
- probably thinner/softer than all above methods (assuming you pick a thin fabric)

I've seen all of the methods above used by good players, so my guess is that there's not a 'right' method. When I started, I cut both layers to give me the most advantage in stalls, but now I only cut the inner layer, hoping it will force my form to be better on stalls.

As far as outside stalls go, I haven't heard of anyone recommending them unless you plan on using outside stalls a lot.

Also, another suggestion...When i got my first pair of Lavers, I didn't bother getting better insoles as I was not doing hard stuff. A few months later, when I tried to remove the original insoles, they were impossible to remove, as the glue had completely settled. I recommend removing them now, and at least put a layer of thin paper or something so the insole isn't glued there permanently. It will save you a lot of trouble later on if you decided to get better insoles.

I feel the same could happen to the two layers of mesh on the shoes, but I'm not sure as I've always cut the insides not long after I get the shoes.

sen · Post by **sen** » 17 May 2011 21:47

I waited at least 6 months before cutting out the inner layer on my first lavers and they didn't seem to be any harder to separate than other people have mentioned. I've never done it to a brand new pair as I switched to Quantums and G-Units after my first lavers died.

Short version: Don't worry about layers sticking together if played in un-modded.